Episode 010 - Filling Up The Cup with ‘Tully’
“I lost my first good mate at 18 to suicide....There’s been seven all up now, suicides… all of them close mates,
‘Tully’ tears into the studio from outback New South Whales and has a chat with Mike and Ben about riding the rollercoaster of life and his connection to suicide. Staying in check with his own mental health has been huge for him since the start of adulthood when he lost his close mate to suicide and unfortunately has lost many more mates since then to the same beast. A genuine knock around bloke that simply believes blokes are better off talkin’.
Talkin Tough is proudly brought to you by Ski For Life, an Australian charity dedicated to promoting mental health, wellbeing & suicide prevention. You can find out more at https://www.skiforlife.com.au/
If this Talkin Tough episode has struck a chord with you and you could do with some extra support, please reach out to a trusted mate or professional or call Lifeline on 13 11 14. https://www.lifeline.org.au/
listen to the full episode:
EPISIODE TRANSCRIPT:
Mike: Let's have some fun boys.
Tully: Indeed.
Ben: Righto. Welcome back to another episode of Talkin Tough. We are pumped to be here, and as always, it is proudly brought to you by Ski for Life, an incredible Aussie charity focused on promoting mental health, wellbeing, and suicide prevention.
And as always, we are here to redefine what it means to be tough. Legless, how are you going, brother?
Mike: Mate? I'm going. Fantastic. Blinder. It's a pleasure to be here. We've got a great guest on today. He's come from the end of the earth. I'm, looking forward to,
Ben: feels like that
Mike: feels exactly where it is to, but it's good to have him in studio.
It's gonna be a fantastic day. And to kick off, as we always do we'd like to throw out a little bit of a yarn. We've got a gentleman by the name, let's go by the name Tully. I think we're just gonna call him Tully throughout this episode. That's his name.
Ben: How are you mate?
Mike: How are you buddy?
Tully: Very well, boys. Thank you very much for having me.
Mike: Great to have you.
Ben: Ronald John Tully the Third Third to be, specific. And we don't go by Ronald or John, we just go with Tully.
Mike: Yeah, you ready to [00:01:00] get stuck into this Ronnie?
Tully: Yeah.
Mike: Good on you mate. No, it's fantastic to be here, as Benny said this, podcast is called Talkin Tough Mate and it's about redefining what tough means in the modern world.
But we like to kick off a little bit of a story and at the end of it I want to get your take on whether this is tough or not. So you ready for it mate?
Tully: Sure I'm ready. I mean it. Let's go.
Mike: This is about a bloke by the name of Barb Van Nen. And so basically this bloke was pulled out of Vietnam by the US and leaving this guy and his family to basically be slaughtered by the Vietcong if they had a left him there.
So this dude decides it's a good idea. I'm gonna steal a Chinook helicopter, right?
Oh, so nice. He, steals a Chinook helicopter. He flies it to his house. He picks up his wife and kids, invites his neighbors to come along for the ride, and then he flies out to sea to find a ship that will allow him to. Land on fumes
he finds a US Navy ship, but it's not nearly big enough to land over the radio he asked for help and the ship allows him to [00:02:00] approach. With precision piloting skills, he manages to hover over the deck of this ship. He then orders the adult neighbor to turf the kids outta the helicopter into the arms of the sailors below.
He orders all of the adults to jump off as well. Then he flies the helicopter out of harm's way of the ship. He was wearing a flight suit, which would drag him underwater. So he somehow manages to remove this suit while still flying the helicopter. And it's my understanding that you actually need both feet.
So I'd be useless.
Ben: You'd be absolutely useless
Mike: to fly a Chinook, a helicopter. So I've no idea how he managed to, how he managed to get the suit off and flying it right. Anyways he ends up crushing the helicopter in the ocean somehow without dying, gets rescued by the ship, gets US citizenship for him and his family, and just becomes this regular humble guy.
Like somehow that's not a hell of a big deal. Boys, is that tough?
Tully: Oh, that is ballsy. [00:03:00] Ballsy. Pretty ballsy.
Ben: Ballsy is one thing.
Mike: Yeah. He was a man on a mission. There was nothing gonna stop him. He was just like, I'm getting my family. And you know what? Neighbors as well. Why not? And come along for the ride.
Tully: Was he a helicopter pilot?
Mike: No, of course he wasn't, mate. No, He was just probably a farmer or something mate. He just jumped into it. Worked out how to fly it somehow and the rest is history. I reckon that's pretty tough.
Tully: It's, yeah.
Ben: Yeah. Tough and ballsy and stupid and brave and
Tully: all the things, but desperate times.
Ben: Call for desperate measures.
Tully: Yeah, indeed. And my dear old mum used to say, there's a difference between scratching your ass and tearing the skin off. And it sounds like old mate went for the nails.
Mike: Love that.
Tully: Definitely.
Mike: Fantastic. Tully, thank you so much for joining us, mate. As we as we like to, in most of these podcast episodes, we like to get a bit of an idea. Growing up an Aussie typical Aussie bloke. Growing up in rural Australia,
Tully: no.
Mike: You would say regional, You wouldn't-
Tully: Coastal.
Ben: Coastal.
Tully: Coastal beach boy
Mike: I stand corrected. Beach boy. Yeah. But what did tough mean to you [00:04:00] based on your influences? I don't know whatever situation you grew up in. What did tough mean to you as a young lab?
Tully: Oh, growing up, I suppose toughness you look to, people older than you at your school or whether it be at the beach, some of the big boys that would paddle out. When the waves were big and 93% of us were sitting there shitting ourselves and, there'd be seven lunatics that would put it on.
So that was tough to me. A bit of footy. You see some, boys that would rip in. I used to think that was tough. Even just family stuff mum pretty much raised us single handed, so watching what she would go through, never had a license in her life. She would put the big ones in to make sure we had food on the table.
Mike: And different Kind of tough though, isn't it?
Tully: Yeah, different. Tough. Definitely. Yeah, I suppose that's what it was when I was younger.
Mike: And you said you'd grew up in a coastal town. Where was that mate?
Tully: Yeah. Town [00:05:00] called the Entrance. Which is halfway between Newcastle and Sydney. Yeah.
Mike: Have you heard of Gosford? I have, yeah.
Tully: Yeah. So we used to have a thing at the nightclub called a Gosford skirt because you could nearly see the entrance.
Mike: Okay. I love it.
Tully: Yeah.
Mike: Nice. Very nice mate.
Ben: Nice
Mike: where do you live now, mate?
Tully: So yeah, I've found myself in a full scene change
no, definitely a seaweed cowboy now. So back in 2004, I headed out west to a little town called Wee Waa which is about two and a half hours west of Tamworth. For those that sort of Know the big towns, a little town of about 1200 people. Cotton capital of Australia. Great little town.
Ben: Yeah. And what made you want to go out there?
Tell us a little bit, take us probably back a little bit. What was growing up as a whipper snapper like and what were you into, and then what led you to going out to Wee Waa?
Tully: Yeah. I suppose that probably leads into the first [00:06:00] tough one. Growing up on the coast, surfing, skating, sport, just typical sleepy little coastal town. Hanging out with the boys, music, writing the guitar, lot of jamming with with mates growing up. And then, yeah, I think I was about, ooh, would've been 23, and got a call from my sisters. Everyone... all the every, all the other Tully's had moved to the Gold Coast by then.
And yeah, got a call saying Mum had been diagnosed with cancer and they'd given her four months to live. So that took me to the Gold Coast for about eight months. She only actually lasted three, so spent a bit of time doing I wouldn't call it palliative care, but she was living with my nan and I was up there to, help the girls with her care and see her off.
So [00:07:00] I was sleeping on a lounge in, my Nan's house. Mum had a bell beside her bed. Would ring that bell when she was in pain or would get up or would mix morphine orange juice, tend to her whatever she needed.
Mike: So you'd have to do all that yourself?
Tully: Yeah, it was pretty solid for a 23 year old.
I'd only just had a baby 12 months before I'd gone from changing my daughter's nappy to changing my mum's nappy and showering and bathing Mum.
Mike: And, you mentioned before that your mum raised you, you got-
Tully: yeah, definitely.
Mike: So your dad wasn't in the picture?
Tully: No, dad... we'd see Dad once, twice a year maybe at best.
Always had some sort of relationship, but never really close. They split when I was about four. Got to know him a lot later in life. But yeah, at that stage I was definitely a mummy's boy. So when the call came through, off I went
Mike: and not only raising you all, but with, without a license, you
Tully: without a license,
Mike: it's a pretty fare bloody effort.
How many times did you have to run [00:08:00] down the street and you put on your push bike to get all the groceries and all that sort of stuff?
Tully: It was push bikes, skateboards. The woman could memorize a bus time table. I tell ya, she knew 'em all by name. They all knew her
Mike: so fantastic.
Tully: Yeah, no, she did it tough, but we, yeah, I'm happy with it. I wouldn't change a thing.
Mike: And obviously very close to your mum Ben? The way your mood just changed when you, you're talking about your mum. Yeah. How tough were those? Those three months or four months, you said kicking after
Tully: Yeah, they were solid.
It actually got to a point where I went to my, I was the youngest of three, so I went to my two older sisters and I said, I just can't do this anymore. It's destroying me all these years of mum raising me and now I'm doing these kid things with mum. And, so she moved on and got professional care and then ended up very quickly in palliative care and, it was all over not long after that.
So it took a, big toll. I didn't take it well. I stayed on the Gold Coast around family [00:09:00] and yeah, it it, probably. It was a big cause to the end of the relationship I had with my daughter's mother. But eventually she died in the July, I went back to the coast, I think in the October.
And yeah, pretty much had to start again. And I was just really angry at the world. I was upset my whole world had just crumbled. So I probably went down the wrong path. Substances and alcohol and just, 23 years old and the lifestyle on the coast accommodated what I wanted to do.
So it took a while for me to wake up to myself and like I say, I was still having visits every second weekend with my daughter and, they weren't being spent the way I wanted, so I decided I needed to get off the coast. For the benefit of her and, myself. So yeah, funnily enough I ended up in Wee Waa.
Mike: [00:10:00] And how was your mental health when you were going through that in that time when you were out partying angry what was your mental health like?
Tully: Angry. Yeah. I was going out and just trying to blow myself up to forget, get very angry, very quick. Not necessarily looking for fights, but looking for an avenue to take my anger and frustration out on.
And one of my best mates I lived with at the time and we would get home and he'd shake me and, try and get it outta me. He said, I'd rather you take it out on me than someone who doesn't deserve it. At least I know what you're on about. And that was a big wake up call.
Mike: Sounds like a good mate.
Tully: Still is. Yeah. Still one of my best, mates. Amazing. Yep.
Ben: Obviously bloody tough. What you were going through and, like you said what, do you mean when you say you, you were spending weekends with your daughter, not the way you wanted to be spending them. And that was the, tipping point for going I've gotta [00:11:00] get outta here and do something different?
Tully: Yeah. I just, I wasn't spending them with her. The mate I live with that I talked about, he was her godfather. She would come to our house and we'd both entertain her to a point, but we'd still be drinking and things like that, and staying up late and she'd, be at the end of the house in a cot and we'd have music going or we'd get the guitars out.
Yeah. I just looked at it and went, it's not on.
Ben: And then you end up. Heading out west.
Tully: Heading out west, yeah. Found a maid who we were talking about cotton and how you can make a bit of cash out there and I wanted to get away from the coast, save a bit of cash and do things and so Yeah.
Ended up at Wee Waa, fella called Ben Kef.
Ben: Of all places.
Tully: Yeah. Of all places. A bloke Ben Kef Yep. Was on our team. And yeah, he gave me my first job and I did a season with them and, met my future wife and, the world Tour started and finished in Wee Waa. [00:12:00]
Mike: Brilliant. How'd you meet your future wife? Tell us that story.
Tully: She was working right next to us, okay.
Yeah. I, had a a job at one of the machines and she was just down the line a bit. Yep. And, we chatted and became friends and we ended up on the... I. on the same days off.
Mike: Okay. Yeah. And your daughter was part of it obviously you would have been having to go back and visit your daughter or was she able to come out and see you and live with you?
For, parts and,
Tully: no she would come out for school holidays or I'd go down and visit her and, when my wife would accommodate that, she was really good with her.
so I think my daughter really got the best of both worlds. She, got that coastal cruisey lifestyle, then she got the fun out in the bush.
She got to come out and ride horses and, quad bikes and do all those rough and tumble kid things in the bush that they do. So
Ben: you've already touched on probably one moment, but if we were to ask you right now, when should hit the fan for you? Yep. And that could be [00:13:00] someone else, it could be yourself.
What are some moments that come to mind?
Especially in especially a rural town.
Tully: Yeah. In a rural town obviously it's a big talking point about mental health. I'd lost probably my first good mate at 18 on the central coast to suicide. That was my first ever exposure to it.
And I don't know, we didn't take it well. It wasn't as, as spoken about as it is now. Mental health and we blamed ourselves, myself and a few mates. We were close with him and we'd distanced ourselves from him a few months before. So when we got the news, it was a massive shock and we blamed ourselves a bit.
And then as you did back then, which I'm a lot wiser at now, but back then I was cranky at him how dare you. And the old saying, oh, he took the easy way out, and things like that. We, didn't understand them. We're 18. We were just cranky that he'd, do [00:14:00] that
Mike: Sure
Tully: to us and his parents and his family.
There was that there's probably, up to about seven all up suicides. A lot of those are from the bush.
Mike: A lot of just close friends?
Tully: Close friends, groomsmen. I've had. Yeah, so I suppose the big one for me, the big one where the shit hit the fan for me was probably the last one was Matthew.
He was a neighbor of mine and like a little brother and best mate and yeah, he used to fight his demons. I knew he did. He used to take it out and cover it over with alcohol a lot. All his mates were country boys who, rough, he was mad on motorbikes, welding, he could do anything.
But he'd always talk to me because I wasn't a country boy. I was a coasty boy. And I was always [00:15:00] open for yarn because I knew I was wiser then as to what they go through. Yeah. When, he let the demons win as they say and took his life that was the one where I put my hand up and went, I'm not I'm not dealing.
So yeah, that was the point-
Mike: so had such a massive impact on you personally, this one?
Tully: Yeah. Yep.
Mike: How long ago was that Tully?
Tully: Oh, 12 months. Just over 12 months. Yeah, just over 12 months.
Ben: So, fairly fresh.
Tully: Very fresh. Yeah. Hence how I am at the moment. Yeah. But,
Ben: Bloody oath.
Tully: Yeah. It's still quite raw, but that really got to me, that one. I wasn't feeling myself after that, and I put my hand up. All the things we've done over the years for, mental health and suicide awareness. I thought it was wrong for me to not put my hand up when I needed help. I'm forever telling blokes to do it, and it's [00:16:00] you know what?
It's my turn. Now I'm gonna put my hand up and I'm gonna go and talk to someone.
Mike: Yeah. Can you tell us a bit about that? Who'd you go and speak to?
Tully: I just I, talked to some friends within the, care industry who got me in touch with a lovely lady in Narrabri. I used to go and see her once fortnight. It started out as grief counseling over Matt.
But she quickly realized when I explained what I'd dealt with over the years with all the deaths, let alone the suicides that yeah. She was the one who taught me to fill my cup up. Yeah she said, what do you do for yourself? Because I was so consumed by making sure everyone else was happy.
I'm one of those guys that make sure everyone's having a fun time. I'm a bit of a rat bag like that. Yeah. But it wasn't until Matt, where I really looked into [00:17:00] myself and went, shit, I'm not Right.
Ben: Seven suicides of close mates is Fucked.
Like to, put it plain and simple, like proper, no there's, noth nothing, good about any of it.
But What do you think was different with Matt compared to the other six? Was there other stuff happening in your life at the time that you feel like you, you just didn't have the energy or, yeah. Were you closer to him than any of the others? What else was going on?
For that one to tip you over the edge?
Tully: I think because he was younger I looked up to him. Like I said, he was just a brilliant kid brewing at everything He did. Yeah. I had that marriage breakdown. I ended up leaving. So I was no longer next door because he would quite often send me a message and say, can you come and have a yarn in the shed?
I'd go over and we'd have a few beers and, he'd just unload. [00:18:00] And he'd only unload to me because I felt like he could talk. As a bloke, it was good to get him to talk to me. After that we didn't really have as much time together. I didn't go back around there as much as I should have.
And yeah, when he passed, I was, I just felt like I let him down a bit.
Mike: Yeah. You blamed yourself?
Tully: Not blamed myself, but I just, yeah. That could have been one of those nights where he called me over and we talked about it like we always did. And, he was there the next day.
Ben: Are did like you having the thoughts of could this have been different if I was still living next door?
Tully: I don't think so. He'd battled his mental health demons for... since high school. Yeah. His, parents had him treated, they'd had him medicated. They'd tried lots of things and, it was something that would come and go, he'd be great for months. And then he'd just get in a little dark patch as they do, [00:19:00] and he'd just pump his tires up and build him out of it. And, we'd be good again for a fair few months.
Mike: Last time was a bit, too much.
Tully: Yeah. There was just a certain event that tipped him over and, the demons must have hit him and, he just thought, As they do, they think there's no other option and, that the world's better off.
Mike: You touched on it a little moment ago, Tully, but you spoke, obviously you've, lost Matt. It's had a, huge impact on you as, Ben just mentioned, the seventh mate. You've got to a position where you've, it's you've realized that, hey, I'm the one now. That's not right. And you mentioned that you went and spoke to a, lady in Narrabri.
I'm assuming this is a professional mental health-
Tully: yeah. Yeah.
Mike: So are we talking about a psychologist, a counselor? What are we talking about here?
Tully: Probably a counselor. At the time it was just grief counseling as it was initially organized. Yeah. I did talk to other people. I'm, always open [00:20:00] and honest with people and I'll tell the boys I'm, not well, or I'm not happy, or I need a yarn.
Mike: You tell 'em, you speak to someone, a professional as well? You open about that?
Tully: Yeah, definitely.
Mike: One of the things I was gonna say just, quickly you, got a lot of blokes who'll be listening to this podcast that would think no. Last thing in the world I'd ever do is go speak to a psychologist. What would you say to those blokes.
Tully: Mate? Unbelievable. Talking to someone you've never met. It gets it's... it gets you to open up. They're not judging, they don't know your history. They don't know your friends. They're not gonna bloody. They're professional.
Mike: Yeah.
Tully: They know the signs, they know what to talk about. They know how to guide you.
They can give you the tools to deal with what you're feeling with. And I just got so much out of it. And since then I've actually put two of my, very well, one of them is my cousin and one of them is the best mate who, live with me. I've put them in touch with her [00:21:00] because they've rang me to say I'm not well
Mike: and how it works.
Tully: How I'm dealing and it works and I saw the effect that this lady had on you. Can you line me up to see her? Which I gladly did.
Mike: So that's come from them?
Tully: Yeah, that's them ringing me saying mate. I need what you got.
Mike: I'm really glad you said that because that's, a reality it can be such a helpful thing.
Just shutting the door on and not having it as an option can be a bit dismissive sometimes. Keeping the doors open and getting help when you need it. So well done
Ben: Yeah.
Mike: on recognizing that you did need to take that extra step.
Ben: Yeah. And I think the other thing I love about it, just listening to it now, is.
Even when you go in to see this lady, you've obviously been open about it with your cousin and your mate as well because they... like, it's not like, I know there's a lot of blokes out there. The blokes do go and seek professional support. That they'll go and do, like they've got at least the courage to go and do it, which [00:22:00] is fantastic, but then they go but I'm not gonna tell anyone that I'm going and doing it.
Yeah. Whereas then your cousin and your mate have obviously seen, known that you've gone and done it, seen the change, and gone. I want, I wanna be in touch with her. I want to, I want that thing that you've been able to get through that.
Tully: Yeah, definitely.
Ben: Which I think's huge.
Tully: Because those two in particular would always ring me to check on me because they knew I wasn't myself.
How are you going, how are you dealing with it? Are you feeling any better? And I'm like, yes boys, I am. I went and saw this lady, she's amazing. I do this, I talk about that. I've got this. I'm filling my cup back up. So... so by the end of my, I think we, we were scheduled for eight and we end up doing 10 sessions.
And I just felt great. And she's looked at me and said, mate, spot on. Brilliant. Good luck. See you about. And yeah, it it got me back to where I needed to be.
Mike: And you've always got that option of going back and having a chat to her whenever you want to. Isn't it ?
Tully: Yeah. Got her [00:23:00] mobile number.
Mike: Brilliant.
Tully: So anytime you feel like you're slipping or sliding, give me a call, John. We'll do it again. But I feel by talking to her, she's given me these tools and ways to recognize certain things that, yeah, I can get a jump on it?
Mike: Can you give us an example of, a tool or, something that she said that really sticks with you where you are?
Tully: The big one was, filling my own cup. Yep. Like I said, I was so focused on helping people with mental health and, suicide prevention and doing wonderful things like Ski for Life and, things like that, that I'd let myself get to this point each time I had. A suicide or a death or anything I'd just push it down, And after Matthew, those black marbles were right up to here. And I couldn't push anymore. I had to get 'em out. I had to empty that cup and start filling it up for myself.
Mike: And you knew the first way that you, dealt [00:24:00] with it when you lost your mum alcohol, substance abuse, those sorts of things, that wasn't the right path.
So it had to be something else.
Tully: No. It was more, especially moving to Wee Waa, it was that clean air the fun lifestyle, great town, new friends just yeah, a different lifestyle. Yeah, it might not be the thing for everyone to make a full blown tree change to help get over a crisis, but it worked for me and, yeah, you just, once you know what you've gotta change.
And for me it was getting off the coast. It might be different things for different blokes, but if you can sit there and acknowledge what it is you need to change, that's the first step.
Ben: Yeah, a hundred percent. And mate, you mentioned Ski for Life. That's how we met in I don't know what year now it be a good five or six years age when you came down. But I'd love for you to talk a little bit about your experience of Ski for Life and [00:25:00] why your team, the Wee Waa team came down for Ski for Life, like to give the geographical map I was about to draw it here on the table and I'm not gonna see the map I draw anyway but, we was literally up in the dead center of New South Wales.
Ski for Life starts near on in Adelaide. It was a- how long was the drive?
Tully: Oh, I can It was two days.
Mike: Two day drive.
Tully: Two days yeah, two days to get there. We're in Northwest New South Wales too. Yeah.
Ben: Righto. Sorry, Northwest. Not central. So I get it. Get it right. That's because I haven't seen a map in a while, mate.
Tully: That's all right. I'll forgive you.
Ben: Thanks mate. But I know that. Around that time there was also a hell of a lot of drought, like obviously Yeah, little bit different now and things have happened since that there's been a bit of rain and, things have changed and they're constantly changing out there.
But at the time, can you talk to us about the broader community and what was going on in the community for a few significant people to go, we need to do something?
Tully: Yeah. Yeah. So like you mentioned, there [00:26:00] was a pretty good drought on at the time. The year we came down, I think it was your first year when they'd first got you in as an ambassador.
So hopefully that helps you remember what year it was.
Ben: Yeah. 2018, I think
Tully: we were going through a pretty bad drought. And yeah we'd, had a few issues in the town and, it all probably culminated with the loss of a good friend of ours, Gus Hamilton, and I'd just before that, lost one of my groomsmen, Kane.
Both had taken their life so wasn't once again dealing very well. And Gus's friends and family had thought of a way to do something to raise awareness. In our community, they looked at different things like rallies and whatever and they found Ski for Life. They looked it up. They're all mad water skiers.
And I get a call outta the blue from Jeff [00:27:00] Constable saying, look, we're gonna do this mad thing where we're gonna tow a boat for two days down to South Australia and ski the Murray, three days. I might insert at this point that I'm a terrible water skier and was purely invited along for team morale.
Ben: Chief of Team Morale
Tully: Chief of Team Morale.
Mike: Yeah. The team mascot mate.
Tully: Pretty much. Yeah, pretty much. So the boys realized that they, decided the three families to get the kids to ski to bring the kids into it and get the awareness out there with that generation. And that I could probably benefit by coming along as the unofficial team captain.
And mate, from the moment we left Wee Waa, one of the greatest experiences of my life. Just the two day drive there was epic. We got there, we met Watty. Geez, we met Greggy and Jane and the, committee, that time was just amazing. Stockey was still [00:28:00] alive. There was some magnificent people I met there all with the same idea.
We give it a red hot go, we had a great time and yeah, we drove home. The, biggest thing for us was the kids, what they experienced. Some of the scenery, skiing the Murray, like I say, we're in a drought.
Mike: Hadn't seen water forever.
Tully: We hadn't seen water. We struggled to find water.
Ben: I was gonna say how did you train in a drought?
We have a little lake out there called Yarrie Lake and we started the kids off by skiing in there.
Mike: That's two by four? That's how Big Lake is out at Wee Waa?
Yeah, it is a swimming pool or what? What's going on there?
Tully: Technically if you read the reports, it was made by a meteor many years ago.
It's a perfect circle in the middle of the scrub, but it eventually dried up, so we had to find deeper parts of the river to put the boat in for the kids to train in.
Mike: And I'm getting flashbacks of Cool Runnings here, mate. When the Jamaicans were trying [00:29:00] to train for the uh...
Ben: With the bob sled team in the middle of the bloody they got no, no snow to be seen stuff. They go there
Tully: pretty much.
Mike: Yeah. Unreal.
Tully: So to get these kids down and see that beautiful big river and meet the fantastic people involved. Yeah just watching them was, definitely the rewarding part. And yeah, I met Ben. I met Amy, I met Stu. Watty, made friends for life. We haven't been back since.
We'd love to go back. We always talk about going back. But even that one year, I now have friends.
Mike: Yeah. That's brilliant.
Tully: That I'll never forget. Yeah. So it's such a great thing.
Ben: What do you reckon was the most impactful moment, or what was the biggest thing you took out of Ski for Life or the kids?
Or what did you experience down there?
Tully: Everyone had the same mentality that I did that they just wanted to help. [00:30:00] The communities that would come down for morning tea lunch. They'd meet us like the river community clubs and they'd cook for us and things like that. And they were all beautiful.
And yeah, just the impact of being around people that had been through what I'd been through with suicide we had that memorial bit where we'd let our balloons go and we had to write tickets. You had to write the name of someone you were remembering. And I had to keep grabbing tickets.
Everyone was grabbing a ticket and writing their mate on it and, here I am just grabbing and yeah, it hit me that shit this is solid. And it was such a moving ceremony. That's probably one thing that'll sit with me.
Ben: The connection through Ski for Life and. The mate you've become not only to myself, but I remember clearly you and legless at at my wedding together and having a grand old time. [00:31:00] And that's probably an understatement, but we probably want to dive a bit deeper into you and what you do for you and what do you do to refill your tank mate?
Tully: I'm not quite as good as legless, but golf is a big thing, but-
Ben: tell us about your golf.
Tully: I don't... dunno why a bloke would pick golf to help his mental health.
Mike: It's hell mate, I'll be honest with you.
Tully: It's, yeah, it's literally.
Mike: It's the best and the worst thing for your mental health in the world. Yeah.
Tully: Oh. But it is that time, especially if you joined a club. And you can go out on a Saturday or a Sunday for a comp and you get paired up with a bloke and you can talk, you can chew the fat.
You've got four hours Yeah, to sit there with a bloke and say,
Mike: Provided he's not a pain in the ass. It's a wonderful thing.
Tully: So maybe that's why no one wants to pair up with me
Mike: or you're the pain in the ass mate. If you can't play with it
Ben: or provided that your balls don't end up in scrub the whole time and you end up walking by yourself on the whole adjacent to it, and you [00:32:00] end up just wandering 18 holes by yourself, looking for your ball, that's what I do a lot of the time.
Mike: Yeah. Mate I, couldn't agree more. I, there's this great saying, I've told, Benny to the ends in the earth, but if you're feeling blue touch green, it's a really wonderful, I'm not sure if there's any green out in Wee Waa. Could be wrong about that. But
Tully: every now and then, you know when it rains.
Mike: Yeah, when it rains. But getting out there and just. Couldn't agree more with you. And whether it's golf or whether it's anything water skiing, whether you wanna go for a run, whatever it is, being able to just switch your phone off, be by yourself.
Yeah. Let out in a healthy way. Let out a bit of steam. It's a really good thing. Unfortunately I would agree with you. Some days on the golf course you think you're going out there for your mental health and you end up in a shitier mood than when you started.
Tully: You end up in the fetal position when you get done.
Ben: I'm gonna ask you two, cause I'm definitely not as much of a golfer. You... you tell me. I can hit it all right.
Mike: Every time Ben just... I line him up, he strikes one down the... I tell him he strikes are down the middle. It's gone four fairways. But But mate, I'm not gonna burst his bubble.
'It was a good [00:33:00] stroke.'
Ben: It felt great to me. And Mike just goes another straight one mate
Mike: Great shot mate. And then,
Tully: I've got a video on my phone of the same thing at Wee Waa of him hitting golf balls.
Mike: I just pray. It doesn't, he doesn't hear the plonk in the water, the sound, and then yeah, we go from there.
Ben: Doesn't, the water shit you on a golf course?
Tully: Yeah. Why do they put it there? What's the need for it? The game's hard enough.
Mike: Yeah. For me and you, mate. That's why. Yeah. It just just seems to be magnetized.
Ben: Especially in on a course in Wee Waa that's prone to drought.
Yeah, look, water isn't a massive issue at the Wee Waa international Golf Links.
Mike: Royal Wee Waa, is it called?
Tully: Oh yeah. Royal Wee Waa. It's been referred to that many times.
Mike: Nine or 18?
Tully: Nine with two tee boxes.
Mike: Yeah. Gotcha. All right. Okay.
Tully: Fancy nine.
Mike: Yeah. Lovely. What were you gonna ask Ben?
Ben: What was I gonna ask?
Mike: About golf?
Ben: No I was just asking like
Tully: What I was doing to To fill my cup up?
Ben: Yes. Yes. Getting back to refilling your tanks. So golf. Yeah. What else?
Tully: Golf. Fishing's another good one. [00:34:00] Fishing is a great one. Standing on... whether you're in the bush or, on the coast, you're standing there at the water's edge and, you're either flicking lures or sitting there staring at your bait and it's a great time just to have that to be in nature and just listen either to the ocean or the cockatoos in the bush. And, it's a good time to reflect there and really look within yourself and, have a think about how things are going. And yeah they're my main two, but I do definitely, I do not shy away from, talking with mates.
Yeah and I've learnt over the years watching, it all go down and watching how I've dealt with it in the past. Now I'm much wiser for the run.
Mike: So it's almost like you picked up a skill there. It's like a non-negotiable. You've gotta have an outlet with mates and you've also gotta have an outlet that's out in nature.
Those are the things that you've built into your life now in order to, be better [00:35:00] and to cope.
Tully: Yep. Yeah, I think recently I've been in a relationship with a fantastic new girl who I'm just nuts about and her outlook and the way I can talk to her has become my biggest tool. She's happy to listen to all my rubbish..
And all the serious stuff and she's so level-headed and I've just found that someone I can talk to, so
Mike: That's great.
Tully: Yeah. I think if people can find that someone, whether it be the opposite sex or a mate that's got a good ear but on the other hand saying that as a mate who's lost mates, I wondered, did I have that good ear? Was I good to talk to? Why?
Those sort of things come up and I thought of different ways I could listen when a mate comes to me and says, I'm not okay. By not throwing out the, cliches and, things like that, but just [00:36:00] shutting up and listening.
Mike: Yep. And you mentioned before one thing that stuck out to me, you used the term easy way out and you don't like that.
Can you tell us why not?
Tully: I just, yeah, look it... I was 18 at the time. But it's not the easy way out, mental health is definitely a serious illness. It's not someone deciding life's too hard. It's, someone that's at the edge and they're suffering through this illness and the only way to stop it they feel is to take their life.
So it frustrates me when you hear about it. In the community or on the media or anything. And, that's just my most hated saying now is he took the easy way out. Because it can be quite savage on him. Everyone deals with it differently. Everyone's dealing with different demons.
Ben: What are some of the things that you are looking forward to, moving forward? Whether it's people hanging out with [00:37:00] family kids, whatever, what's the future hold? And with what you've been through, what are you looking forward to?
Tully: Yeah, I've found my dream job out in the bush. So that side of life is really great. I'm now in a relationship with a fantastic girl. So that's great.
Mike: Beautiful.
Ben: Tick.
Tully: Yeah, tick. Big tick. So I'm yeah, I've got some kids out there that I spend some time with. My own kids. I might add not anyone else's. Yeah, mine
Ben: nice to clarify.
Tully: I'm sure though, one's got red hair, but I'm still sure he is mine.
But yeah, just looking forward to spending time with kids. I'm in my early forties now, so my outlook on what I want and what I'd like to do going forward. Yeah, I'm just really looking forward to the next 12 months and the next 12 years because I've got my head and I've got my [00:38:00] life right. And things are really coming up Tully.
Mike: Fantastic. Yeah, I love it. Gonna throw a few questions at Tully. Just some quick fire questions you're gonna answer off the top of your head. You ready for 'em, buddy?
Tully: No, but you can ask him anyway.
Mike: Okay. Shnitty or steak mate?
Tully: Steak.
Ben: What sort?
Tully: Huh? What sort?
Ben: What type, what cut, how we having it?
Tully: Gimme a scotchy, medium rare mushroom sauce.
Ben: Oh. I like a man who knows what he likes.
Mike: Fantastic. Yeah. And where, are you gonna switch off Tully?
Tully: The Royal Wee Waa golf course
Ben: golf course.
Mike: Yeah. Book, Poddy or Tunes?
Tully: I've never actually listened to a Poddy
Ben: and now you're on one.
Tully: And now I'm on one, so that's a bit ironic. Tunes definitely. Music is massive for me. Genre. I am everything growing up on the coast. I am punk, rock heavy, metal jamming to charact. the bush. I am all the country and everything in between.
Mike: Love it. Fantastic. [00:39:00] Now you've spoken about the importance of having yarn with a mate.
So where's the best place to have a yarn, you reckon?
Tully: Face to face, anywhere. Face to face. Don't do it over the phone.
Mike: Yeah. Worst advice when it comes to mental health that's floating around out there?
Tully: There's always someone worse off. I hate hearing that because saying that to someone who's suffering. Yeah. In that person's world, they think theirs is the worst.
Mike: Doesn't help.
Tully: No, it does nothing. Trying to get them to-
Mike: and the flip side of that, what's the best advice you reckon?
Tully: What's the best advice you've heard about mental health?
It's probably one little thing that I use for my own wellbeing and that's that I have a hundred percent record of getting through the shit days.
Every time I feel like I'm having a shit day and things are getting tough, I look back and go, you know what, I've got a hundred percent record. I get through every shit day.
Mike: Yeah, that's great.
Tully: I'm still here.
Mike: Love that.
Ben: That's a great one. I love... like it's funny because you, when you're in the shit day, quite often we [00:40:00] don't think about the shit days we've been through prior to that shit day.
And Yeah that's an awesome reminder to all of us out there cause I've never thought about it like that. And there's still moments today where I go, fuck, I'm having a shit day here and I wish I could see, and I wish that things were different, but I've had hundreds of those days and I've had days where, like you say, you lose loved ones or you go to funerals or you move by whatever... like you, whatever it is, it doesn't matter what circumstance it was, you've had those rough days that you're just a wishing to be over.
And we've been through it
Tully: and we survived them.
Ben: And we're still here. Yeah. Yeah. So I that's an awesome one.
Mike: Great one. I think we could take a lot from that. And I think lastly, but most importantly, mate you've, talked us through some pretty heavy stuff. The loss of your mum, loss of seven of your mates battle with mental health demons.
You yourself, knowing what you know now and your definition of tough back in the day, the old [00:41:00] footballers and the bravado, what does tough mean to you now Tully?
Tully: Tough now is You see it particularly in the bush with this persona around mental health. Tough is standing up and being open and honest and true with yourself and those around you.
Opening up just talking. It's 2023 now, blokes can talk about their feelings. Don't sit there and think, 'oh, I don't wanna look like a pussy or, no one's gonna get what I'm on about'. It's, a new ballgame. It's out there. Talk up. That's tough is being able to put your hand up and say, I'm not doing well.
Let's talk
Mike: Fucking love it.
Ben: Mate. That's, I was gonna say, if we were out to redefine what it means to be tough, I think we'll take that as a definition.
Mike: Yeah. You'll be on advertising reel for the next season. Cheers mate!
Ben: Mate, it has been an absolute pleasure having you on.
Tully: [00:42:00] Thank you.
Ben: We've had a ball.
Mike: Absolutely.
Ben: But more importantly really appreciate you being able to open up especially about your mate, Matt, your mum those harder parts in life and leading by example, by talking about 'em, because that's what, like you say, there's a still a persona and a stigma out there that we don't do it enough.
And I would agree that we don't, but hopefully by having more conversations like this that we start to change that and it takes all of us to wanna change that. It takes all of us to feel what we're feeling, but then go, it's okay to talk about the way we're feeling. So mate, like we said, yeah, absolutely appreciate it.
It's been awesome having you on. Thank you so much.
Tully: No worries. Thanks for having me.
Ben: As always, if today's episode has struck a chord with you or made you think about a mate that might be doing it tough, that has shown some warning signs. Either one of those things. Pick up the phone, call a mate, have a yarn with them, have a chat [00:43:00] or go and catch up with 'em face to face, and if they don't pick up or you can't do that, you can always call Lifeline on 13 11 14.
Take care of yourself.
